first of all ttc is in fourwheeler not 4wheel & off road (theirs is the ultimate adventure)  and ever see or hear of how those truck run when they loos their 4x4 not to good  

Those trucks also have no weight on the rear end and have to push the extra unnecesssary weight caused by having 4wd.  If any of them knew how to drive a 2wd truck it wouldn’t get stuck.  Anyway I understand that having 4wd has impaired their driving skills.  It’s not your fault that ignorance has caused you guys to think that 4wd trucks are the only capable mud boggin trucks out there it is Petersen’s 4-Wheel and Off-Road’s fault for not covering these capable 2wd trucks in their magazines. They have damaged your driving skills by making people like you incapable of driving a vehicle to its full potential by making you think that you need useless things like ARB air lockers in the front and rear on a 4wd truck. I really do feel sorry for you. Maybe one day you will see how bad you have it and buy a real truck without the useless weight that is added by 4wd. You should have saved yourself the trouble and got a real truck like mine.  Now if they would just allow a 2wd truck to enter the ultimate adventure you would see just how capable they really are.

There are exceptions to every rule! This is the exception that proves the rule! - just kidding.

I'm not the only one that feels this way about IFS. I didn't say it couldn't be done, just that I personally would not go that route. It's probably just a matter of time before they go in the mud turnin '42's.

If it were me I'd get the insurance on the 2wd truck and drop a Moser engineered straight axle in there! After ya got the insurance, what he hell does the insurance company know abou it.  I'd go with the Dana 60 myself.

I'm not knockin anyone who wants to go two wheelin in da mud, - to each his own! More Power to him! I just prefer a 4X4, personally, than be worryin that I'll need to get yanked out of a hairy spot I bury myself up to the axles in. I'm sure he avoids the really deep holes with this in mind, or he drives around the edge' of 'em. IFS is the best for goin nuts on a trail or off-road, but da mud ? That's a differnet story in my book.

....and 2-3 times as much money to fix too! You know what mechanics charge these days if ya can't do the work yourself ? I could probably buy 3 more K5's with the money he'll be spendin to get it fixed after a hard hit.

A mechanic wanted $200.00 labor just to get a frozen steering arm off the knuckle on my '77 K5. I whacked it with a small sledge and a pickle bar until it came free - 15 minutes, and saved me $200.00! - I had to install a raised steering arm for the lift at the time. I'm still workin on that cross-over steering! the finances are not co-operating yet.

You can't compare the strength of any IFS (except maybe a high end rig like one built for the Dakkar race ) whether it's on a 2wd or a newer 4wd to a good straight axle like a GM 14-bolt ff or a Dana -60. And your not even on the same planet if you compare it to a Rockwell axle.

I can't disagree with you there! the skill of the driver (in any event) is half the battle. You can have the worst driver in the best truck and he'll lose by lack of skill and intimate knowledge of how his ride handles. I personally would not be opposed to letting the 2 wheelers try to prove themselves, but my opinion is obviously biased sice I come from the 4X4 world. - It don't get much more 4X4 than a '77 Chevy K5 like mine!

Legereb reminded me that I think some C3500's still come with solid axles. They usually have a huge 8-lug hub and 19" wheels, but maybe it'd be cheaper to buy one of those trucks and convert it to a solid axle 4x4, since the steering could be the same.

Or is it still cheaper to get a new steering and brake system than to get a t-case, front axle and crossmember to hold the t-case?

Anyways, those chassis cab 1 tons with solid axles (2wd) are probably very strong.

One of the reasons I'm not surprised 4x4's IFS is weak is think of all the individual parts needed. If they built the IFS thick and strong enough they couldn't be broken turning 40" tires in 2 feet of mud, the whole front end would weigh at least 100 lbs heavier. All that extra weight would cost more money in raw materials. Most OEM's are happy to build something thick and strong enough that it should be just good enough in regards to general industry trends. Modern 4x4 trucks already weigh 300-400 lbs heavier than the same truck with 2wd.

Since most ppl who buy new 4x4's also like the bling-bling wheels, street tires, paint on graphics, lots of cup holders and decorative step bars I don't think many are upset that the trucks can't handle offroading with 35" mud tires. It wouldn't make good business sense to make the front end stronger if only 5-10% of their customers might care.

I don't avoid the deep parts.  Just last year I blew my engine up after driving through a hole after it rained.  I had water coming out my air conditioning ducts.  Just as I pulled out of it my truck just locked up.  Also I have never taken my truck anywhere to get worked on.  I have done evrything myself.  So far I have rebuilt the engine, 4L80E, and 14 bolt, Ect.  I would never allow anybody to work on my truck.  I thaught about puting a D60 in the front and I probably would have if it weren't for those idiots that made fun of me and my truck.  There is nothing better than watching someone with 4wd struggle to go somewhere after talking *** about your truck.  Then going through it like it's nothing.  Or the best is when you go to pull a truck out that has 38s and just backing into the same mud hole then yank them out like nothing.  You should see the look on their face when they find out that they got owned by a 2wd.  You should also see how pissed people get when I beat them with a 2wd in the mud boggs.  There is nothing better than seeing someone fliping through the rule book trying to protest my truck.  I haven't won yet but I have never ended up in last either.  

You keep at it dude! With that attitude and drive I'm sure you'll get the win one day! A lot of things change when someone with new ideas and a way to make them work applies them. 4X4 and Off-road have seen a whole lot of innovation over the last 20 years. Must be nothin sweeter to ya than pullin out a 4X4 with your 2-wheeler!

I wish I could have the money and confidence to be able to do everything on my truck myself. I don't like to let anyone work on my rig if I'm not sure of their expertise and quality of work. I've gotten burned a few times by so called "4X4 experts" - the ones who own and operate their own "performance Off-road shops" can be the worst!! I got ripped by one who didn't know a pinion angle from a hole in the ground! He even recommended installing lift blocks in the front on my K5! - Now you know the guy's an idiot!

I've taken on a whole lot more since getting burned a few times. Lerned how to Mig weld, do quality lifts, and custom exhaust on my own.

Yeah that's exactly why I won't allow anybody to work on my truck.  Maybe one day when I can put that unimog 404 rear end in my truck it will put my truck where it needs to be(in 1st place).  I had an "off road" store in Little Rock try to rip me off with a lift and then they tried to tell me that they wouldn't sell the lift to me without them installing it.  I went to Cabot Tire and Off Road and they sold it to me but laughed at me when I baught it.

Most auto and truck manufacturers don't think that way dude! If it don't break, they don't make any money on replacement parts!!  The world turns around the almighty dollar today, and nothing else!!

That's whay they invented the modern CV-joint front wheel drive vehicle! - The Ka-ching factor!

Most modern IFS is too complex a system to go mudding with in my opinion, and anyway, what real advantages are there to IFS over an articulated Solid Axle in a mud bog  anyway ??  Off-road and trails, yes, bud mud ??

I agree that most people buying a truck today are puttin 20-inch wheels on 'em and more concerned with the comfortable car-like interior and A/C ( cup holders and step bars), than anything about the trucks abilities off the pavement. I don't think it would help sales because the majority of their market share is the 'bling' crowd and not the mudder crowd these days. Heavy duty IFS would just be too heavy for mudding too, for the same reason most diesel trucks don't do well in da mud - way too much weight up front.

The most recent "thick and strong" truck I know of in recent history is the Hummer H1. That's the only IFS system I would consider. - not H2 or H3's though - 'ems too 'bling' for my white ass!  IMO

The 'expert' that burned me on my first lift neglected to tell me that I would have to replace the steering arm with an extended height one for the 4-inch lift I was doing, and he didn't mention the need to get extended brake lines - two for front axle and one for the rear axle, either. I guess he thought that would be a 'gotcha' expense after he did the lift and it wasn't driveable. Lucky for me he got sick and could not complete the work after my ride was in his shop for two weeks. I cancelled the whole thing and did the lift myself with some knowlege gained from forums like this one. He did burn me with the exhaust he recommended - a dual 3-inch Holley Warlock system. I found out that I don't have the horsepower yet to handle dual 3-inch exhaust (gasoline engine). I just trashed the Warlocks that robbed me of all my power (low back-pressure), and custom assembled and welded my own 2-1/4 dual exhaust with some Flowmaster Super 40's with an H-pipe (no cats). Now my Beast has it's original power back and then some. - live and learn from it!- another graduate from the school of hard knocks!

LOL redbeast! That website idea does sound cool. (grin)

All I meant before was that if 80-90% of the customers demanded a truck to handle 35 inch mud tires going through deep clay mud and still not break parts, they'd probably want to find a way to do it.

I also agree beefing up the IFS parts would still be bad for mud, since your front end would get heavier. Old big block muscle cars might have had a front to rear weight distribution of 59/41 but a heavily built IFS 4x4 pickup could be more like 65/35 which would be so stupid in mud it'd be hilarious.

I love the specs of the H1! The H1 comes stock at 6'3" tall, has 16" of ground clearance and rides on 37" tires.

 A modern 4x4 truck, lets say a K1500 is also about 6'3" tall but has maybe 8" ground clearance and rides on tires under 32" tall. Even if you removed the fenders of an unlifted K1500 and added 37's, the K1500 would now be about 6'6" tall and would only have 11" ground clearance.

 All other Hummer knock offs all too tall, too narrow, have even less ground clearance etc.

I firmly agree with the lack of 2wd truck coverage in your magazine. I own a 2000 ford ranger/regular cab/2 wheel drive with the trail head package which features the 4wd suspension and tires. I swapped out the stock tires for some 32/10.5-15 bf goodrich mud terrains as well as a 2 inch body lift and it grabs the mud by the horns. I like 4wd's but can't justify the extra cost for minimal traction benefit. They're really good in the snow but only a fraction better on the muddy terrain in west texas. I manage class 3 trails frequently with my 2wd and don't have to worry about the maintenance and repair costs of a 4x4. legereb, I am considering a suspension lift for my truck and would like a little of your advice. You really seem to know your stuff. 2WD's ROCK DUDE!  

I would rather drive a mini van than waste time on a gutless H1.  Even with the 6.6l duramax they are still gutless.  Sure they work if you are rock crawling but as soon as they see soft dirt or even mud they are done the tires cake up and you can't spin them fast enough to clean them out.  They also won't climb sand dunes worht a *** either.  I just don't see why people would like them so much.   

Speaking of rock crawling, have any of you 2wd guys ever tried it?  I was just wondering because I've heard the talk about mud drags and so on but how capable is a 2wd at crawling?